Report of Advisory Group to the Forum on Patronage and Pluralism in the Primary Sector: Statements, Questions and Answers

Report of Advisory Group to the Forum on Patronage and Pluralism in the Primary Sector: Statements, Questions and Answers

Tuesday, 1 May 2012

Senator Ivana Bacik: I welcome the Minister to the House on this auspicious day, 1 May, as he was the Minister at the time who introduced the May Day bank holiday. I also welcome members of the Portobello Educate Together School Start-Up Group who are in the Gallery and I thank them for coming along. I should declare that I am chair of the group and that we are one of the groups seeking change in our system. I commend the advisory group, Professor Coolahan and his colleagues, on producing what is a comprehensive, measured and balanced report. I take issue with Senator Mullen who has unfairly characterised it as being in some way biased or skewed. It takes a very measured approach and deals with a number of pressing issues. I have heard other colleagues suggest that patronage is not a pressing issue but, clearly, quality of education - I speak as a parent - is the most pressing issue, of which patronage is a key part. I went to a rural national school that was Catholic in ethos where the Catholic faith formation dominated the day.

Senator Fidelma Healy Eames: Look how well the Senator turned out.

Senator Ivana Bacik: It affected the quality of my education and I do not mind saying that. I think that is true of many schools, although not all because many schools seek to be accommodating. I know of children who have been turned away from schools because they were not of an appropriate religion and of others who were put very far down waiting lists. That happens. The opt-out mechanisms that are in operation, as the report has pointed out, are unsatisfactory. This was pointed out to the advisory group by numerous stakeholders. We need to bear in mind the context within which the advisory group has produced its report and the context in which the Minister, Deputy Quinn, rightly commissioned the report in the first place, which is that Article 42.3.1° of our Constitution provides that, “The State shall not oblige parents in violation of conscience and lawful preference to send their children to ... [a] particular type of school designated by the State.” In a system where more than 2,800, or 90%, of the 3,200 national schools across Ireland are Catholic-run, there is clearly not any excessive pandering to the non-religious minority who, according to the recent census, now comprise-----

Senator Rónán Mullen: We agree on divesting

Senator Ivana Bacik: -----the largest group after Roman Catholics in the country, as the Minister pointed out. Only 60 schools in Ireland are multidenominational under the patronage of Educate Together, the group to which the Portobello group-----

Senator Thomas Byrne: There are gaelscoileanna that are multidenominational.

Senator Ivana Bacik: Yes and the gaelscoileanna make up approximately 50 more. About 4% of our national school system is either multidenominational under Educate Together or under the patronage of the gaelscoileanna movement. These are the two biggest growing movements of parents. In my group in the Portobello area in Dublin we have more than 600 parents of nearly 350 pupils pre-enrolled and we are hopeful that we will see divestment take place in the near future because we have a real and pressing need.

In that context I very much welcome this report. It has tried to address the need for greater inclusion and greater diversity in the school population and it has done it in a measured way.

Senator Fidelma Healy Eames: With the permission of all the parents in that area.

Senator Ivana Bacik: What it seeks to do in terms of the divestment issue is to, first, examine the areas where there is demand from parents in accordance with their constitutional rights. It is taking a minimalist approach in saying there are 47 catchment areas. Obviously, that is something already established with the Department, and in those areas it is setting out a blueprint as to when divestment can occur. In our area we hope we will be covered by a provision in the report which requires, at recommendation A4, that where there is established evidence of parental demand, divestment could proceed without the need to go through the phases that the report has set out.

The report has also made some valuable and important recommendations for stand-alone schools and for the need to ensure greater inclusivity and pluralism in those schools. In that context, I ask the Minister when he anticipates a first divestment might occur. Clearly, I have a particular interest in my own area and we hope our school will be open if not this year then certainly by 2013. In terms of the blueprint the report has set out - it has set out a very detailed timeline - when does the Minister think we might see divestment occur in the 47 areas? The report is very mindful of the need to ensure community sensitivities are considered and that parents are brought along with the process, and that is important.

Senator Fidelma Healy Eames: It will not work otherwise.

Senator Ivana Bacik: That is acknowledged. I wish to make two further points. On the issue of faith formation in schools where there is no divestment, where there is a stand-alone school under the patronage of usually the Catholic Church, will faith formation be able to take place outside of the school day? The report recommends a variety of different ways where this could be done but clearly there might be difficulties with having it within the school day where there is a significant minority in the school.

In terms of the VECs and the community national school model, the report, at page 48, expresses certain reservations about the model, notably about the segregation of children within the school day for faith formation, which is certainly at odds with some of the demands of the parents. It also refers to the difficulty about the boards of management within the school. Some of the issues around the VEC schools that are of concern were highlighted in recent RTE reports, about which the Minister will be aware. It might be something on which we could reflect.

Educate Together, as an established and national patron, I attended its AGM on Saturday, as did the Minister, and it has charted an important and progressive way of offering education to children in a multidenominational ethos that is respectful of children of all faiths and none and which has a proven track record not only among parents who do not have a particular religion. I have plenty of Catholic friends who are very happy to send their children to the Educate Together school locally and I have plenty of Catholic friends who are very unhappy because there were not enough places in their local Educate Together school.